Cozmo D

Yep. Most people have no problem paying and giving credit when it is rightfully owed. Though Will and I have never met, we have run in adjacent circles for a long time. First of all, I'm not sure he did a lot of sampling on that album. He did an interpolation of my stuff. On interpolations you don't usually have to pay up front, and then what you do pay is a percentage of your publishing, which means that no money is paid unless money is made. 2nd, I really give less than a fig newton about your budget. Try going into a store and getting that MPC 3000 for free by crying to them about your budget and see what happens. If you can't afford to use my stuff... DON'T!!! If you can't afford to use samples... DON'T!!!

Yes "we" are, I think. Cases like this are extreme but it doesn`t happen often. You can say a whole nation is kinda racist just caus some extreme Groups do stuff like that. It`s a fact that most of the Europena Country are less racist than big parts of the U.S.A. Oh, I'm done. I won't bother with Renagade Tim and Maddblock, their stuff is too far out there to be taken seriously. :paperbag: :word: Stop making a diffrence between black and white. I'm glad that you Europeans can think that way. I'm waiting for the day when we can think that way in this country too. Hopefully it will happen before I die. :word: That would be great. But can you explain to me why it isn`t the same in the U.S.A. than it is here (Europe)? Because here in the USA we have had legally institutionalized racism up until just 40 years ago, and still have the illegal kind. :stars: That`s sad. But I think that`s gonna change with the coming generations. Yup, me too! Just hope I get to see it! :1-say-yes:

Oh, I'm done. I won't bother with Renagade Tim and Maddblock, their stuff is too far out there to be taken seriously. :paperbag: :word: Stop making a diffrence between black and white. I'm glad that you Europeans can think that way. I'm waiting for the day when we can think that way in this country too. Hopefully it will happen before I die. :word: That would be great. But can you explain to me why it isn`t the same in the U.S.A. than it is here (Europe)? Because here in the USA we have had legally institutionalized racism up until just 40 years ago, and still have the illegal kind.

I've got no problem with somebody using my stuff to get noticed, or to get a deal. In fact, people ask me to do this stuff all the time, and I usually tell them to go right ahead. There's a HUGE difference between that and using my stuff to make you money and then you not paying me my fair share.

Oh, I'm done. I won't bother with Renagade Tim and Maddblock, their stuff is too far out there to be taken seriously. :paperbag: :word: Stop making a diffrence between black and white. I'm glad that you Europeans can think that way. I'm waiting for the day when we can think that way in this country too. Hopefully it will happen before I die. :word:

If you sample WITHOUT PAYING FOR IT or changing it to the point that it's unrecognizable it's stealing. That's all I am saying. If you use my bassline for the bassline in your song than you are using MY work for your bassline, not YOURS. BTW, I'm a producer too... :2thumbs:

That is not true. Most black and latino CITIZENS in this country are considered middle class Actually, that was city wide and we had more block parties and park jams here in Brooklyn than they did in the Bronx. "Rapper's Delight" didn't have anything to do with it ending either. Not a huge point but it needed to be said. :wiggle: Hip-Hop did not become commercial until Run DMC's "Walk This Way", the Beastie Boys and MTV's Yo, MTV Raps. It was then that the majors first started getting interested and marketing to white audiences began in earnest. Maybe world wide, but no way in the USA. Definitely more white fans than black here, but nowhere near the disparity in numbers. In fact, that would mean that 14% would be "other". Prodigy dodn't exacly said, if he means USA or world wide. Personally I thought he was talking about world. Yeah, that could be. I would really like to see that data though. Lers agree with it. What's next? Nothing. That's totally on Mobb Deep. :shrug: Why? So why it is so big blank beetwen white & black hh listeners? Maybe it is link up with material things. It's a BIG country man, with a LOT of different areas and peoples. A LOT of white people don't care for Hip-Hop or other types of Urban music, and a LOT of blacks and Latinos don't care for Rock or Country. Just a quick example. It's all good.

"Rapper's Delight" introduced Hip-Hop to the world, period. It had nothing to do with any white acceptance or perception of Hip-Hop. It was the first Hip-Hop hit, nothing more, nothing less. The population thing is completely off. Latino is a demographic that only speaks to this hemisphere, and the black population worldwide I'm sure at least equals of the white considering that the population of Africa is greater than that of Europe. That may be in YOUR country my friend, but not in the USA.

Hip-Hop did not become commercial until Run DMC's "Walk This Way", the Beastie Boys and MTV's Yo, MTV Raps. It was then that the majors first started getting interested and marketing to white audiences began in earnest. Maybe world wide, but no way in the USA. Definitely more white fans than black here, but nowhere near the disparity in numbers. In fact, that would mean that 14% would be "other". Prodigy dodn't exacly said, if he means USA or world wide. Personally I thought he was talking about world. Yeah, that could be. I would really like to see that data though.

Maybe world wide, but no way in the USA. Definitely more white fans than black here, but nowhere near the disparity in numbers. In fact, that would mean that 14% would be "other".

OK, where do I begin... :lol:

I just can't get over the gall of this statement! You show the artist you respect them by sampling THIER work, then say if they need money they should get a job like everybody else. HOW 'BOUT YOU DO YOUR OWN WORK!!! How is stealing showing respect? That's like telling some chick that you rape that she should be flattered because you thought she was worth raping. Don't want to pay me? THEN DON'T USE MY WORK!!! :mad:

I really don't know how to answer this. Have you ever created anything in your life? Anything? Are you saying that everybody in the world could have the right to just take anything that you created and use it, and you would be fine with it? :stars: First of all, there was no sampling involved. It was an interpolation, which makes it a copyright and publishing issue, and those laws have been around longer than records have. 2nd, I really can't speak to this with you because you are not dealing in the real world. I'll tell you what though. Since you plan to do music, why don't you put this utopia of yours into motion by GIVING AWAY all of your rights for free. Put a disclaimer on all of your songs saying that anybody who wishes to can have all of your material free of charge. Good luck with that! :2thumbs: Thanx again R2R!!! Nope, nothing to sue for here. You can't copyright a rap cadence. :lolsign:

What did he use of UTFO's in "If You Can't Dance"? Why shouldn't people complain about their property being stolen? Would you say the same thing if 50 Cent stole some old JJFP hook and didn't pay them? Because JJFP got away with stealing on "He's The DJ..." they should be able to get away with it now? Depends... I'd have to hear it.

Thanx R2R, that helped a LOT! OK, this was a MAJOR hook in the record, it would require much more than a mere phone call. It was not just lyrics, it was melody as well. If it's mine, GIMME mine! However, from Tim defining the situation for me, it's clear that what went down is a bit different than what you guys are saying. The main culprit in this suit was Bobby Robinson, who was claiming sole writing and publishing credit for the ORIGINAL song. This means that Will and Sony most likely did what they were supposed to do by giving credit AND publishing, just to the wrong guy. Of course, F5 will sue anybody and everybody involved in order to ensure that they get all of what they deserve. If it turns out as it seems that Bobby Robinson mislead Will and Sony by telling them that he actually had sole ownership, Will and Sony can then sue him to recover damages. There's a HUGE difference between a line and a hook. You can't copyright 1 line of lyrics, but you can copyright a group of lines. In this case Will used a group of lines that was equivalent to 12 bars. Used it twice too. It's an open and shut case. Mixtapes are for the most part pure copyright infringement, but they're just not worth pursuing in court. The small street level ones are a waste of time and money to sue for, and the larger ones have developed into good promotional tools, so copyright and sound rights owners will usually just sign off on them. Oh, they care, but you're too small a fish for them to pursue. If you luck out and it somehow blows up to a position where it's actually doing something though, they WILL come see you. :1-say-yes:

Man, there is so much misinformation, bad information and just plain wrong information in this thread that it's frightening... :ohdear:

You see, now I resent most of this. If somebody uses my lyrics I am flattered, but they are still MY lyrics, and I expect to be compensated for it. The way the song is described here it does not appear to be a homage to F5 at all, but Will's using a recognized lyric to enhance his song. Does he shout out F5 in the song? If not, how can it be a homage? Even if he did and it was, why shouldn't he have to pay them for using THEIR property? Will used my bassline in his song as well as twisted my lyrics a bit, and yes, I was flattered. But, because I expected to get paid as well that makes me jealous or bitter? I'm supposed to just be happy that he used MY bassline and lyrics while he rides them to the bank? :noooo: This is a BUSINESS folks! Could be more ignorance on his part than an intentional wrong. The sound rights and copyright owners could, absolutely.

OK, then it's not a sample at all then. Guess it's the translation. Lyrics in interpolations are always tricky, because you are supposed to get permission if you change anything. Again, I'm quite sure that a simple phone call would've taken care of it. UNLESS OF COURSE, F5 don't actually OWN the publishing... The article is saying that Will used their sample without permision. Thats for sure. Im not sure about lyrics. Just check lyrics on the net, & then we will know if Will also re-rapped their lyrics or download "Superappin" & compare Will song & original version. Could be that the article is wrong Damian, since everybody else says that it's just the lyrics. I have no idea since I've never heard the Will song.

Not only was it before Rapper's Delight, it was more respected on the streets than Rapper's Delight. Thanx Lerkot, I haven't listened to it in a good 20 years, and I actually HAVE the damm thing! :lolsign:

OK, then it's not a sample at all then. Guess it's the translation. Lyrics in interpolations are always tricky, because you are supposed to get permission if you change anything. Again, I'm quite sure that a simple phone call would've taken care of it. UNLESS OF COURSE, F5 don't actually OWN the publishing...

Will has an entire legal team dealing with all the people sueing him..its just we dont hear about it all.. Ready Rock C's case was thrown out because the statue of limitations had passed.. as far as the will2k thing that was Columbia/Sony's fault for not properly clearing it.. I think they only acknowledged 2 members..and the others sued for there royalties.. I'm sure WS and JPS have lawsuits filed against them but they get throw out cos well the lawsuits are just stupid just sum ppl trying 2 make easy money. But I mean like major suits like RRC and Furious 5. Like Furious 5 thing..I agree it was Sony's fault..they didn't handle that well and left Will 2 hang. RRC got money out of WS even when courts ruled in Will favor. RRC should have taken the offer 2 be on Williennium. I still think RRC did it cos well he burn his money and the others WS and Jazz invested their money wisely. Nobody truly knows but them. We need to remember that everybody is human and everybody has faults. I personally know of a couple of business dealings that they have done with people that may not be illegal, or even unethical, but are definitely shady. :paperbag: Hmmm... Did he say it only once or was it a major hook in the song? The usage would be the crux of the argument, though at the very least he should have given them an acknowledgment. Just one time. And to yall who says its Sonys fault... sure, it could be, but it could also be like that Will forget to inform Sony about using the line... I dont know, no one knows. Well, if that is the case I can see him trying to get over with it, but he should have known better. That's the kind of thing that you make a phone call for and promise to put fam down on a gig or 2 and all is love. However, if I'm F5 and I don't get a courtesy call, I'm kinda pissed. And there is enough there to sue and get some publishing, so if I'm pissed enough... This 1 is not on Sony, it's on Will. A phone call probably doesn't cost him a dime or even any credit, just a shout-out to F5 in the liner notes and a look-out in a show or 2. That wasn't a line, it was a recognized classic hook. It was the same as incorporating somebody else's chorus into your song. If Will had used it for a chorus himself, he could easily have forfeited half of his publishing for it. If he looked up to them he should've respected them. It was his place to call, not theirs. Now, if it's about a SAMPLE that's a whole other kettle of fish. :hmm:

My eldest didn't go to school today (College) though he did get a ride to and from work. I drove my youngest to school (HS) and picked him up, but he only goes about 1 mile away. Traffic was murder though. Luckily both the wife and I work at home.

Moreover, kids aren't generally interested in black history outside of black history month. If we can remedy those things, we can get rid of the month. Black history month exists because black history isn't adequately addressed in general American history. :word: How did we ever get into all of that crap? We agree almost all of the time! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

LOL!!! Chief gotta nutha one!!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Hmmm... Did he say it only once or was it a major hook in the song? The usage would be the crux of the argument, though at the very least he should have given them an acknowledgment.