bigted

Pete Rock and CL Smooth "Return Of The Mecca"

Nick Cannon ain't that wack as you think he is, I think he's better than Ying Yang Twins and 50 Cent, those cats are so annoying, I wouldn't mind if Nick Cannon got more airplay than them, but he's a FP wannabe. The only young rapper at this point that has a chance to have a successful career is Bow Wow, he's comin' of age now, "My Baby" was a pretty deep song, he's starting to get away from that teeny bop rap now. Big L started the punchline level? Damn you must be young! FP, Rakim, LL, KRS, and other legends have been spitting superb punchlines for only 20 years now, today's rappers use their lines! :poke: Kanye West can't even beat Jin The MC in a freestyle battle(did you watch 106&Park 2 years ago? Incredible punchlines!) let alone FP. Anyway this is my last essay on this topic, but I gotta say this now, here's a whole bunch of all-time rappers that're better than today's pop rappers, besides the others I mentioned, don't forget about: Slick Rick, NWA, Doug E. Fresh, MC Lyte, Gangstarr, Beastie Boys, Kool G Rap, Too Short, Dana Dane, Poor Righteous Teachers, De La Soul, Arrested Development, Tribe Called Quest, EPMD, Wu-Tang Clan, Leaders Of The New School, Pete Rock and CL Smooth, Naughty By Nature, Snoop Dogg, Scarface, Outkast, Warren G, Whoodini, Hieroglyphics, Salt-N-Pepa, Brand Nubian, Afrika Bambataa and The Zulu Nation, Das Efx, Monie Love, Heavy D, Fugees, Redman, Masta Ace, The Roots, Big Pun, DMX, and Fat Joe(then after you could probably mention Common, Mos Def, and Talib Kweli) If you heard all these artists I don't think Jay-Z and Kanye West would blow you away! :chuks:

I have some respect for Kanye West 'cause he's giving effort to do something different than any other rapper, but he came in the game as a producer, get that through your head, FP got signed as a rapper at a time where it was harder to get signed, and the reason why I mention Nick Cannon is 'cause he came in the game as a comedian not a rapper either, although I have some respect for him 'cause he's trying to bring the comedy back, if you don't get signed as a rapper, stick to whatever else you do, come on now the game's so wack right now even Shaq could make an album. :kekeke: "All Falls Down" and "Jesus Walks" are weak efforts to top the Blastmaster, you're crazy! His "Spirtual Minded" album is more conscious and thought provoking than "College Dropout" and that wasn't even KRS best album, Kanye West ain't changin' s*** though either, he's overrated big time, Nas is the best rapper now, Kanye bit his style from Common, who's put more dues in this game to be on the sidelines when Kanye West blows up.

Don't y'all think longevity should be a factor in deciding who's the greatest rapper of all time? How could somebody with one album be put in the top of the all time list? That's like sayin' Lebron James is the greatest NBA player of all time already. :hilarious: What if I made an album that sold 10 million and won 5 grammies in one year, would that put ahead of KRS and FP that've been out for 2 decades with consistancy? Hell no! Even if KRS-ONE retired or died right this minute, his music is gonna stand the test of time, wait and see. Why ain't nobody mentioning Queen Latifah she's one of the best mcs to ever step on the mic! Her lyrics are very thought provoking. How many songs does Jay-Z have to do about being a drug dealer growing up, at least Will ain't repetative, each of his albums have different themes, Jay-Z reminds of Eminem, he says the same s*** over and over, I heard it before dog, I wanna hear something different. And since this thread started on performance none of these current pop rappers could outperform JJFP in a live show, period, Jay-Z' a mediocre performer, no energy at all, even James Brown still has more energy than Jay-Z does.

The Roots, Eve, and Eraka Badu "You Got Me"

I think these hip-hop magazines need peeps like us to drop knowledge for the mainstream heads. KRS-ONE and Chuck D are genious beyond albums, they write books too(Now run get "Ruminations"/It's a book that I published for the healing of this nation), "It Takes A Nation Of Millions To Hold Us Back" is the greatest album ever 'cause Chuck D is set to release a book based on the idea of creating that album, how many albums could you say that drop that much knowledge to write a book about it? Like I said before it shouldn't matter how much you say, it's what you say that counts, a lot of lines today in hip-hop are fillers, back then every line mattered it seems, Vanilla Ice was the only wack mc it seemed, now there's a whole army of wack rappers("it's like a circus now/with a bunch of clowns/and a bunch of cliques i could probably rap circles around"-FP), there'd be no need for Nick Cannon or Kanye West to pick up the mic if it was the golden age, they'd got burned. Now you could like Kanye West and Jay-Z if you choose but you can't put them among the all-time greats without knowing the history, what they're doing now was done better 15 years ago and KRS' producing of "South Bronx" is better than any of Kanye West's productions, it's all love though man. :peace:

It's a shame that he's screwing up right now over drugs, he's been one of the best mcs to come in hip-hop in recent years, hopefully he could get his life together.

Former star linebacker had intestinal cancerESPN.com news services CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- Sam Mills, an undersized linebacker who became a Pro Bowl player with New Orleans and Carolina and was later an assistant coach for the Panthers, died Monday after fighting cancer for nearly two years, the Panthers said. He was 45. Mills, who was diagnosed with cancer of the small intestine in August 2003 but continued to coach Carolina's linebackers between chemotherapy treatments, died at his home. "Sam was one of the finest people you will ever meet. You would never know that he was a player who made Pro Bowls and had all this attention because he treated everybody the same no matter who they were," Carolina general manager Marty Hurney said. "He never had a bad thing to say about anybody and had a great ability to laugh at himself. "He was the type of guy you want your kids to grow up to be." A five-time Pro Bowl selection, Mills spent the final three seasons of his 12-year NFL career with the Panthers, beginning with their inaugural season in 1995. There is a statue of him outside Bank of America Stadium and he is the only player in the team's Hall of Honor. Mike McCormack, Carolina's first team president, is the only other inductee in the Hall. "Words are inadequate to express what Sam meant to the Panthers organization," Carolina owner Jerry Richardson said. "We were privileged to have him as a member of our family, and we are devastated over this loss." Mills spent his first nine NFL seasons with the New Orleans Saints, following three seasons in the United States Football League. He finished his career with 1,319 tackles while starting 173 of 181 games. He joined the Panthers' coaching staff upon his retirement. "He's definitely the best coach I ever had," Panthers linebacker Will Witherspoon said. "I got to talk to him the last couple of weeks and I knew that he wasn't doing well, but he never wanted to bring that up. "He always wanted to focus on how I was doing. There's nothing better than the fact that he concentrated more on other people than he did himself." Mills was an undersized linebacker out of Montclair (N.J.) State who tried -- and failed several times -- to catch on with NFL and Canadian Football League teams. He gave professional football one last shot when the USFL debuted in 1983, and parlayed a tryout with the Philadelphia Stars into a roster spot. "The USFL came at a perfect time for me," Mills, a three-time All-USFL selection who helped the Stars win league titles in 1983 and '84, said in an interview in March. "It was the most fun I ever had playing football." Every day, Stars coach Jim Mora asked his assistants who the best player on the field was. Every day, they told him "Sam Mills." "I don't need a 5-9 linebacker,"' Mora kept saying. Mills ended up as one of Mora's favorite players and when Mora went to the Saints after the USFL's demise, he brought Mills with him in 1986. Mills went to his first four Pro Bowls with the Saints and was elected to Louisiana's Sports Hall of Fame. He is also a member of New Jersey's Sports Hall of Fame. "Sam was a member of the Saints family and the community here in New Orleans and those times will be forever cherished and never forgotten," the Saints said in a statement. "He was embraced not only by our organization but the whole community who loved his spirit, his positive attitude and his drive and determination. "He never backed away from a battle and took on each and every challenge with the heart of a champion." Mills moved on to the Panthers in 1995 and figured prominently in the franchise's first win, against the Jets on Oct. 15, 1995, at Clemson, S.C., when he intercepted a shovel pass and returned it 36 yards for a key touchdown. He led the team in tackles in 1995 and '96, when the Panthers won the NFC West and made a surprise run to the NFC title game. Mills was diagnosed with cancer in 2003, hours before he showed up at the stadium to coach the Panthers' linebackers in their preseason finale. It was a devastating blow to the team, which had learned two weeks earlier that linebacker Mark Fields also had cancer. Carolina restructured its coaching duties the next week to take some of the responsibilities off of Mills during his treatment. Originally given just a few months to live, Mills battled the cancer and didn't miss a single game that season. He scheduled treatment for off days to cut down on his time away from the team, and he often had to coach from the press box that year to preserve his strength. "The club basically gave me the option as to how much I wanted to be around," Mills said. "Hey, I am a football coach. That is what I am. As long as I have the power in me to go ahead and continue to coach, I'd like to continue to coach." He was an inspiration to the team that season as Carolina won the NFC championship and went on to the Super Bowl. Players wore his No. 51, along with Fields' 58, under their jerseys that season, and Mills gave an emotional pregame speech during their playoff run. He flew to Houston on the Thursday before the Super Bowl, one day after a round of chemotherapy, and joined Fields for a news conference. Sweating and holding on to the podium for balance, he said "You have your good days and your bad days. I am just glad I am having days, you know?" Mills continued his treatment all of last season. He was honored by the NFL in March with the Johnny Unitas Tops in Courage Award. "Although it can be said that he left his imprint on the NFL as a player, it is his legacy as a human being that serves as an example for all of us to follow," said Bill Kuharich, Kansas City's vice president of pro personnel, who was with Mills with the Stars and Saints. Mills is survived by his wife, Melanie, and four children: Sons Sam III and Marcus and daughters Larissa and Sierra."

Check out the lyrics for KRS' 2003 "It's All A Struggle" song, these are real hip-hop lyrics, better than "Jesus Walks": "[Chorus: KRS] + (guest) It's all a struggle (tryin to make it day to day) It's all a struggle (from my hood to around your way) It's all a struggle (single parents all by theyself) It's all a struggle (diseases decreasin your health) It's all a struggle (fiends swearin that's they last puff) It's all a struggle (hustler tryin to avoid handcuffs) (No matter what you do, who you are or where you from) (Rich poor black white, at the end of the day) [Verse One: KRS-One] It's all a struggle - and most people's struggles are doubled You ain't the only one with a challenge facin some trouble Look at the woman chewed up by the dog with no muzzle Or the workers that got trapped underground in that tunnel Some kids are playin in pools, others in puddles When they listen to the news the propoganda is subtle But it's time for you to know that the cryin got to go Release the guilt that you built and let it flow Slow and low, that is the tempo Move slow and on the low, this you gotta know You don't get the muscles without the hard struggles You ain't the only one out here tryin to get dough From the hustler to the preacher to the government leaders From the airline pilot to the chef to the teachers We linked in the same huddle, in the same tussle'n'bustle Cause at the end of the day, it's all a struggle [Chorus] [Verse Two: KRS-One] It's all a struggle - but don't let the challenges bug you Or the government drug you, or the thieves in the street beat and mug you - build your tunnel under the rubble Come up on the other side eye to eye with the trouble Look at the Twin Towers crumble Look at the religious leadership stumble, everybody struggles But not everybody comes through nifty, it's fifty/fifty The city itself will outrun you quickly Whether you be healthy or sickly Whether you be wealthy or thrifty, ugly or pretty Everybody's tryin to get 50's and 100's I taught this at UCLA just off Sunset Now run get "Ruminations" It's a book that I published for the healing of this nation In just a few chapters we run through, some possible solutions Cause at the end of the day [Chorus] [KRS-One] It's all a struggle"

Common's "BE" is that dope, better than "Lost and Found"? I didn't even know it came out yet, "Resurrection" which is his best album shouldn't even be in the top 10. Doing a top 10 is hard but I think most of the great albums, if not all, came out in the golden age of hip-hop(late '80s/early '90s) 'cause they set the standard for hip-hop today, this is the "Dark Ages" of hip-hop, today's standards are wack(money, hoes, and cars, no subject matter) none of these albums you listed except "Illmatic" or "The Chronic", "Lost and Found" is probably the best album this decade on any level of hip-hop, should be in the top 10 considerably My top 10 would be this: Public Enemy "It Takes A Nation Of Millions To Hold Us Back" Run-Dmc "Raising Hell" Eric B. and Rakim "Paid In Full" LL Cool J "Mama Said Knock You Out" Slick Rick "The Great Adventures Of Slick Rick" BDP "Criminal Minded" NWA "Straight Outta Compton" 2Pac "All Eyez On Me" Nas "Illmatic" Will Smith "Big Willie Style"(Since It Ain't JJFP) Doing a top 10 song list is even harder but I'd say: 1-Grandmaster Flash and Furious Five "The Message" 2-BDP "Love's Gonna Get Ya" 3-Doug E. Fresh and Slick Rick "The Show" 4-Public Enemy "Don't Believe The Hype" 5-Nas "The World Is Yours" 6-LL Cool J "Jack The Ripper" 7-KRS-ONE "Step Into A World"(Rapture's Delight) 8-2Pac "Keep Ya Head Up" 9-Will Smith Feat. Mary J. Blidge "Tell Me Why" 10-Tribe Called Quest Feat. Leaders Of New School "Scenerio" Damn it's hard to do these lists without mentioning "He's The DJ, I'm The Rapper" and "Code Red" albums and "Summertime" and "Brand New Funk" tracks, those were all time greats in my opinion.

Kanye West is just a good producer though, not an mc, did he win battles on the street like FP did? No, 'cause he was just a producer. Hip-hop ain't as great now as it was 15 years ago, do you think Kanye would stand a chance if he came out in the late '80s? To compare "College Dropout" to "Criminal Minded" is ignorant, I'm not just ol' school bias when I say that, I like some stuff out now but a lot of it I find ignorant, a lot of underground cats who've been rappin' for years would murder Kanye West too, I missed the great years of hip-hop by the time I got into it, he can't beat KRS-ONE in a lyrical battle, have you heard KRS' recent albums? He's still droppin' knowledge on mcs, but it's on an underground level, if he got the promotion he deserves, mainstream peeps would easily see that his rhymes are more intelligent than Kanye West and every rapper in the industry including Nas, who I think is the best out today besides FP and LL on a mainstream level. I got a couple of Talib Kweli's albums, they're hot, he's definately a great mc, I like him more than Jay-Z and Kanye West 'cause he keeps his lyrics positive and is a great lyrical cat, but he'd even lose to KRS-ONE. KRS-ONE was, is, and will be a pioneer in hip-hop for years to come until he hangs up the mic. Yeah I should write a book from these posts I made. :kekeke:

My prayers go out to him and anyone else dealing with this serious situation in their lives.

"DMX Arrested After Crash Involving Cops NEW YORK - DMX was arrested following an accident on a Bronx expressway that injured three people, including two police officers, police said Monday. DMX, whose real name is Earl Simmons, was driving southbound Friday evening on the Major Deegan Expressway when his car struck a vehicle being driven by an unidentified woman, police said. Her car then hit an unmarked police cruiser carrying two officers. The woman was taken to Lincoln Hospital with minor injuries, while the officers were taken to Columbia-Presbyterian Hospital, also with minor injuries. All three were treated and released. Simmons wasn't injured. Police said the 34-year-old rapper was given a desk appearance ticket and was expected to appear in court sometime next month. Simmons' lawyer, Murray Richman, wasn't available for comment, a woman who answered the phone at his office said Monday morning. Last June, Simmons was arrested for allegedly smashing his sport utility vehicle into a gate at Kennedy Airport after telling a parking lot attendant he was a federal agent. He later admitted to being on Valium at the time. Simmons pleaded guilty in that case and was sentenced to a conditional discharge, meaning further violations within a year could land him in jail. He also was fined and ordered to forfeit his sport utility vehicle. Besides his top-selling rap records, DMX has acted in films including "Never Die Alone," "Romeo Must Die" and "Cradle 2 the Grave."

Come on Da Brakes why don't u participate in the battle? It's no question anytime the battle starts I'll be ready.

I'd rather see Will do a song with Britney Spears and Vanilla Ice than 50 Cent, r u serious man? :hilarious: :hilarious: 50 Cent is the biggest disgrace to music ever right now, it'd ruin FP's career to collab with him, hell no!

Yeah even LL Cool J, Nas, and KRS-ONE do that when they're on radio interviews they'll rap one of their songs over another beat, being mc is about moving the crowd with your flow so it's all good, FP has proved why he deserves to be among the all-time greats, haters can't front on this or they're braindead. :poke:

People say that he was sellin' out on this album 'cause he was rappin' about money, jewlery, and a lot of fancy things on here but he's only been making millions of dollars for 12 years at that time, I'd say that he has more right to talk about it than any of the other pop rappers just comin' out at that time, he's paid his due in this game, it's not like it was his 1st album like some ignorant peeps might think, even Jay-Z talked about how much money he had on "Reasonable Doubt" and that was his 1st album is the argument I could give you, but I ain't gonna front though, that was a classic album just like "Big Willie Style" was, nobody said hip-hop had to sound a certain way, hip-hop is about representin' you and your life, so when Will talks about how much money he has it ain't a lie 'cause he's rich as hell, but when Jay-Z still talks about how he's runnin' the streets now that's a lie 'cause I'm closer to the streets than he is now. Now my favorite mcs in hip-hop are JJFP(that's why I post here so much), LL Cool J, KRS-ONE, Nas, and Public Enemy, I know everyone ain't gonna agree with me but I think that they represent the hip-hop culture well, but I couldn't rank them ahead of Rakim(except KRS-ONE) realistically, I think KRS-ONE is the greatest mc to touch the mic realistically, but if I had to vote who the best mc is of all time, I'd vote for Will 'cause he's my favorite, I know the difference between opinion and fact pretty well, but I think it's a safe fact that my favorites should be considered on everyone's lists of all-time greats. Sorry for such a long ass post but I just wanted to set things straight here 'cause I don't like my favorite rapper being called a sell-out.

Remember this Keith B. Real Skit, this explains it all -Now Will let me ask you something do you think that you make quote unquote real rap music cause I ain't never seen no Wu dancing wit no singing alien keep it real -Well brother I like to have a good time have fun with the music that I make you know let people have fun It wasn't sellin' out doing this album 'cause hip-hop needed somethin' fun after hearing about Pac and Biggie being murdered. "Don't Say Nothin'' is a song on that album he addresses to haters: Don't Say Nothin' Yo (let's talk about) When I released my first single back in like '86 People was like oh you know that's popcorn and you know they weak You know then I mess around I go world trade on them Bangin out them multi-plats they still got negativity to bring My thing is you can't say nothing nice don't say nothing Take your place allow me to flex a taste As my accomplishments bring up my comp like mase Face me the star of stage and TV My face be seen in almost every country Grammy winner soon to be oscar nominee Who he that's dressed jiggy straight from West Philly Thought I was wack cause I wanted to act Now every brother and his mother that rap be trying to do that The ill kid Hundred million dollar bill kid The one you love to chill with come on keep it real kid Don't try to act like this summer at the greek You won't be bumpin the big Willie in your jeep I know y'all still feel me Really don't act silly Thought I feel off just becuase I left Philly Took a break from the rap thing went on hiatus I picked up the art of acting and multiplied papers I chilled on silk sofas chatting with Oprah She asked me if it's true that me and Jeff broke up (hell naa) While y'all kids busy playing drug pimp and playa I was at my crib in Barbados chillin with Jada to date her Vertex is me the magnanimous Got you saying damn I've always been a fan of his Y'all know how it is oh wait hold up y'all don't Look here y'all don't say nothing then I won't Just don't say nothing (don't say nothin) Just don't say nothing (don't say nothin) Man I love being me ready to rock ya block With some more hot top notch ___ for you to cop No more mr. nice guy My whole life I've been smiling when I felt like whiling Jealousy swinging on me made his attack (He soft he wack man that ain't real rap) You believe that It hurt me at first but it's cool Took the insults fed em to my ego used it for fuel Now everywhere I turn a dead end Hundred women coming at me waving pads and pens And they be screaming out (Oh my lord) Did you see it's that (Brother from ID4) Now can I please get (A picture and your signature) Sure you can miss (Oh my god my girlfriends they ain't gonna believe this) Worldwide wait nah hold up galactic Hear my name don't nothing change but the accent Bangkok to Madagascar they wanna see me Princepe in Spain Japan I'm kota ishe I like my steaks thick and my jets private And my son to ride in the cockpit I know hes only four taking lessons from the pilot While I'm on my cell with my broker getting stock tips Find a magazine and I read the hottest gossip Man who'd a thought my life would be such an interesting topic Well y'all know how it is wait hold up y'all don't Well look here y'all don't say nothing than I won't Just don't say nothing (don't say nothin) Just don't say nothing (don't say nothin) Just don't say nothing (don't say nothin) Just don't say nothing (don't say nothin) Go ahead adjust the balance and the bass in your speakers Make sure my voice sounding crisp in your tweeters I'm about to show you how a man like me works My shorty get ice five carrots and nothing cheaper Four five chromed out former two seaters Fifty inch sony to watch Siskel and Ebert Cause I'm about to get two thumbs ten toes one knee and probably a couple Of elbows Cause yo I'm the man and the whole world knows Rock film festivals and rap shows All the critics jealous people and back-stabbers My so called friends who been nothing but actors You're way of character but now who's the bomb It's Will from west Phil just slightly transformed Y'all know what it is Ah damn that's right y'all don't But look here y'all don't say nothing then trust me I won't

Yo man you think Jay-Z, Common,Talib Kweli, Biggie, 2pac, and Nas all have more skills than Rakim, you're crazy! Rakim inspired all these cats to have the structure they have, they all bit their styles from Rakim and "Paid In Full" which is arguably the greatest album ever made, they got nothin' on him. Kanye West has more skills than Will? How old are you man? Kanye West ain't a rapper, Teddy Riley even has more rhymin' skills than Kanye West. "Big Willie Style" was not a sell-out album, that was still hip-hop, just the singles were pop rap songs, he wasn't rappin' about being in the streets, that's what would be sellin' out 'cause he don't live in the streets, and it featured one of the deepest songs he ever made "Just The Two Of Us", if you don't think so then you might as well say Fugees and Busta Rhymes sold out 'cause their music was upbeat too at the time, Jay-Z flip-flops more than Will ever did in his career, he says he's street one minute, then he's rappin' about how rich he is, then he says he's street again, why don't Jay-Z just be real and not talk about the streets anymore 'cause he's now a rich man, come on now, what does Will have to do? Start talkin' about bustin' guns, slingin' crack, geting high, and start sellin' alcohol to get hip-hop credability? :confused3: Now if we talk about skills we shouldn't forget to mention Kool Moe Dee, Melle Mel, Kurtis Blow, Grandmaster Caz, Busy Bee, and the many other pioneers of hip-hop, they shouldn't be buried to the bottom of the list just 'cause they never sold much, they even paved the way for Will and KRS to get some recognition, to mention Kanye West, Jay-Z, Mos Def, Biggie, Common, or even Talib Kweli before them is a disgrace, the real pioneers should not be forgotten even though they didn't have the longevity that Will has.

You must be lookin' at the wrong chart, Will sold 30 million albums that's more than any of them(except 2Pac, but people flocked to buy his album after his death) MC Hammer's one album "Hammer Don't Hurt 'Em" sold more than Nas' entire career(MC Hammer could outperform Nas but Nas could outspit MC Hammer, 2 different type of talents, both great at what they do, as much as I like them, I wouldn't put them in the top 10 all time mcs realistically 'cause there was a lot of great mcs that came out from the late '80s to mid-90s, it's hard to do a list 'cause everyone had their own styles), and where's LL, he's sold 20 million in his career, but talent doesn't measure talent, KRS-ONE, Rakim, and Chuck D deserve to be in the top 5 with LL and JJFP even though their sales are lower than most of today's pop rappers, they still spit knowledge, but they just don't get marketed well, they choose to do it that way and their few fans like me respect them.

:werd: That's a shame that the best female singer in music is a drug addict. :mad8:

Of course it's a freestyle! Half of it was "The Chosen One" lyrics but then he said this one's for you Tim and he drops a freestyle, it's a freestyle, damn it, don't make him come here and slap you, he could still spit freestyles! :poke:

JJFP "I Wish I Made That"(Remix, now this is hip-hop epitomy!)

Hey anytime y'all wanna do it, if I got a minute, I'll spit it, we might even have to get Will to come by and battle! :poke: :ali:

Yeah that remix is fire, that freestyle was crazy too, yeah it's official it's a freestyle(he dedicated it to you Tim!) u da man Tim! :bowdown: