Original 2pac Material Petition

[JumpinJack AJ]

Thanx 4 posting this. I've been upset about what they've done with 2Pac's music for years. Ever since 2000, alot of his stuff has been remixed and nearly all of it from his last 3 full albums has been. I love the idea that this has gotten attention by the people who can make a difference. It's kinda funny that about 8,000 people have signed this becuz off the millions of albums that he sells each time, it's probably those 8,000 who are true fans who didn't jump on the band wagon during All Eyez On Me or when he passed.

I think Loyal 2 The Game waz the last straw. Eminem sucks as a producer. The only trax i really like off this new album are Ghetto Gospel, The Uppercut, and Don't You Trust Me...and they even need at least a lil' work. I love the "bonus trax" not produced by Eminem. They are really good. I listen 2 them along with the 3 i mentioned earlier all the time. I don't mind them being remixed at all becuz they have 2Pac's sound.

It's time 4 change and this petition waz the right start.

[mfuqua23]

The only reason Em really got his hands on it was because he sent a "manipulating" letter to Afeni about producing Pac's music for the next album. To be honest, I don't made the re-made beats done to Pac's music. Most come close to PAc's sound. Plus having the chance to get originals all over kinda makes it less annoying. Even if the 'originals' aren't the quality of sound U'd buy mastered in a studio, they still have this classic-ness to them that makes them special. Usually the songs I found hard to listen to on Pac's previous releases after 7 Day, I was able to go back and listen to em. Not favs, but cool.

[JumpinJack AJ]

How can u say they are close 2 2Pac's sound?!? I know u are a 2Pac fan and have heard his early albums...how can u say that Eminem's work is anywhere near the sound or quality 2Pac put out. 2 me, pretty much every beat sounds like Eminem-production. Every song sounds similar. I look down the credits of the album and see names like Johnny J and 2Pac himself as original producers of the song and i'm wondering why on earth they'd have Eminem produce new beats 4 the album. The original work had 2 be far better. And the altered vocals where it sounds like 2Pac is shouting out G-Unit makes me ill. That's like someone remixing "Boom! Shake The Room" and having FP give a shout out 2 Vanilla Ice. I think it's clear that real 2Pac fans have spoken when it comes 2 this petition (that most of them don't even know about). Eminem clearly made alot of 2Pac fans mad. As a result, i hope Eminem realizes that he simply dosen't have support from real Hip-Hop fans. His production sucks and his view of what music should be, especially for a Hip-Hop icon, is not what mature fans want. Maybe the 13 year old suburban kids who don't know what real Hip-Hop is like it...but not the real heads.

[mfuqua23]

What? I wasn't talkin about Em's beats being close to Pac's sound.

[JumpinJack AJ]

To be honest, I don't mind the re-made beats done to Pac's music. Most come close to PAc's sound.

Sorry, i thought that statement waz made towards the beat Eminem put 2gether. I think the song "Ghetto Gospel" is amazing...but when i compare those trax produced by Rapheal Saddiq and Scott Storch 2 Eminem's, it disappoints me cuz even in all it's dopeness...the song could be more powerful. The only thing that bugs me is the weak synth line on it....if a real producer got his hands on the track, i think it'd be on the same level of "Changes."

[Guest lambertj3]

aj and bigted i think you are or have been brainwashed to think you speak for evry true hip hop fan

[JumpinJack AJ]

U always gotta put words in peoples' mouths. Neither of us said that. However, generally, people who are in2 true-skool Hip-Hop tend 2 have similar opinions as we do. And why do we always get called out when most of the other people who have spoke on the topic agree with us!? The people who actually think 2Pac waz done right on the production tip for Loyal To The Game are, like u, are fans of Eminem, G-Unit, and all that stuff. Their standards have nothing 2 do with real Hip-Hop...just commerical radio crap.

[mfuqua23]

I heard two bonus tracks, "Loyal To The Game feat. Big Skye and ??? (DJ Quik Version); and "Crooked N**** Too" (Raphael Saadiq). They were both aight. Loyal was a lil closer to Pac's sound if he'd do something with today's production. But because I've heard the original "Loyal To the Game" (which is a bonus on the Above The Rim Soundtrack cassette), I didn't like Quik's as much. Crooked didn't sound quite right wit the way Pac delivered his lyrics. I think Saadiq would be better for lyrics Pac wrote around his time wit DU. Anywhere from '89-'93. I don't think they should remix anything Pac had out when he was alive. "Loyal to The Game" wasn't necessary. That's the only one I think was really released somehow back in '94.

[Guest lambertj3]

i didn't put words in people mouths just look what you wrote and commercial radio crap i think not and although i loved this board for its diversity there are more people out in the world as old as me or older who agree

[bigted]

If you talk to people that listen to rappers like 50 Cent, Nelly, and Jay-Z and you mention to them about ol' school artists like KRS-ONE and PE they'll tell u that they never heard of them, like Kwame said in that interview a lot of fans think that hip-hop started with 2Pac and Biggie, they're ignorant of the history of the game, and btw there was nothing wrong with 2Pac having many sides, that's what made him such a great lyricist, I respect his whole career.

[JumpinJack AJ]

Yeah, 2 think Hip-Hop/Rap started with 2Pac and Biggie is rediculous. 2Pac pioneered a certain style, and i think Biggie just made the NY scene very popular (no 2 insult him...but i don't think his lyrics were that impressive). 2 me, their murders kinda ended the era of the commercial state of Hip-Hop. The early years, going on in2 the mid-90's were filled with progression of Hip-Hop, it's different styles and subcultures. Alot of people, think that The Chronic, All Eyez On Me, and Ready To Die were the 1st real rap albums out, which is so ignorant. 2 be ignorant 2 what came b4 and the underground stuff of 2day is anything but knowing what Hip-Hop really is. Before 2Pac and Biggie's murders, half of the hardcore Hip-Hop and Gangsta Rap had substance, and even tho' it wazn't what alot of us wanted, it wazn't that bad. When they passed, it seems like all this C-level artists got attention and the music went 2 hell. Commercially, most of the stuff since then hasn't been very good. U had The Fugee's blowing up...Nas, the continued success of A Tribe Called Quest and De La Soul, then Big Willie Style, OutKast, Black Eyed Peas, but 4 the most part, the artists and the music hasn't been any good and the true talent never shines thru.'

I think that if they were still around, 2Pac would have taken Hip-Hop 2 new levels. He wanted off Deathrow and talked about dropping more introspective stuff like Me Against The World and music with no explict lyrics.

[mfuqua23]

AJ, i don't think it was a matter of getting stuff like MATW out. But PAc's always been personal. He said that was his fav, but it was too sad. As far as Pac goin', I don't feel bad about that. It just happened. But I just feel bad and upset about how everything is. Both the '94 and '96 shooting, all the pieces from the puzzle missin'.

2pac would've took hip hop to new levels, even if he wasn't in it anymore. Pac said he wouldn't care if he faded out and wasn't hot anymore. He said he had love for everyone in the rap industry (but I think that was before he got a letter from someone concerning Biggie and his crew)

When U say their murders end commercial hip hop, I assume U mean the good of it?

[Guest lambertj3]

i see your point bigted rap started with afrika bambatta

[JumpinJack AJ]

When U say their murders end commercial hip hop, I assume U mean the good of it?

Yeah, generally speaking. Up until then, even the hardcore Hip-Hop, gansta rap, and commercial rap at least wazn't so bad. But since then, the majority of it just hasn't been any good. People seriously have lowered their standards as 2 what is good music. Also, the true skool emcees usually only have small followings these days. The people are pick up Shock-G's new album, Talib Kweli's new album, and De La's new album, The Roots new album, aren't the same people picking up Nelly's and G-Unit's albums. So the celebrity and big success lifestyle isn't really open 2 them. G-Unit, D12, Disturbing The Peace fans are typically young kids who have never been exposed 2 good music or real Hip-Hop. It seems like cookie-cutter, talent-lacking puppets like G-Unit are made 4 the charts and making money....not 2 creativity or the state of Hip-Hop at all. Artists like J-Live, Mos Def, and so on are keeping things fresh, creative, and new...yet they aren't even trying 2 hit the Top 10 with their records cuz they aren't gonna sell out 4 all that. After 2Pac and Biggie passed, mainstream and commerical Hip-Hop and Rap just got awful.

[bigted]

These young cats won't know who Afrika Bambataa is if they don't even know who KRS-ONE is, hip-hop history month ain't celebrated on the mainstream like it should be and that's why it's so messed up, cats need to be educated.