White Audience for Black Conscious Hip-Hop

[bigted]

It ain't Dr. Dre's fault, he's a great artist, it's the million people who try to copy Dr. Dre instead of being original is the ones I blame, you should be yourself if you wanna make it, I don't wanna be the next Chuck D, Will Smith, or Dr. Dre, I just wanna be myself, but not many people think like that. This reminds me of what I was reading in a book called "Where You're At?":

"I'm talking to Bobbito Garcia, one of the most celbrated hip-hop DJs in New York. Bobbito, with his parner Lord Sear, is the host of CM famalam on WKCR but is best known for his show with Stretch Armstrong that just about spanned the 90s between WKCR and Hot 97. a member of the Rock Steady crew(the original B-Boy crew), in his time Bobbito has been a professional bsketball player(in Puerto Rico), a journalist for the likes of Vibe and The Source and head of the respected Fondle 'Em label, and he's a DJ who's in demand the world over.

“Look”, he sighs. “When people say hip-hop is dead it just shows they're not in touch. People talk about the elements of hip-hop culture, but, I tell you, in any period of hip-hop, the best stuff always had to be searched for. That's why I say that search and discovery is the most neglected element of hip-hop.”

But these days hip-hop is a global buisiness...

“So? Just because hip-hop is accessible globally, that doesn't make it good. But people can always find a way to hear good music. I can't tell you the number of places I've gone where they know my show, through the Internet or their friends making tapes or whatever. It's just about good music. If people want to listen to Jay-Z, they can. If people want to listen to my show, they can. Everybody has choices and nobody has to listen to anything they don't want to.”

[JumpinJack AJ]

The Chronic is a dope Hip-Hop album....but it opened the door 4 all these wanna-be'z that just took the gun and weed talk and based their entire albums off it. After The Chronic, everybody waz gangsta. It's not really Dr. Dre's fault...but that's the way things panned out.

[Schnazz]

As to the reason for the expansion of gangsta hip-hop, I would suspect that it has a lot to do with economics, and an exploding market. In the early days of b-boys and what not, what did you do to make music? You went to a party or hung out with your friends, and you did your thing. The entrance fee was talent, which gave us a lot of diversity and experimentation. A lot of the music wasn't even put on vinyl (or tape), and if it was, it was usually done/sold locally. All a very lost cost endeavor. Then you had a revolution, Run DMC. At this point, a reasonable amount of money became involved, both in costs and in revenues. However, at this point, all that was known about the medium (from the record execs eyes) is basically "Hey, rap can sell." The amount of money was still minimal (compared to, say, the amount of money surrounding Wham at the same time). The result was that you had execs that didn't have a formula yet, but where willing to risk a modest amount of money. Since they're weren't any "facts of the industry" yet, and not much money was involved, the decision making process on who got signed was pushed further down the corporate ladder, often all the way down to people that where still directly involved in the "scene." Then there was another revolution, gangsta rap. Keep in mind this wasn't defined but The Chronic, but The Chronic was the culmination point. All of a sudden there was huge amounts of money involved and a formula (either good or bad, depending on if you're a fan of money or of hip hop) was available for how to make money. By having the formula and huge money as a motivator, record execs now took keen interest in hip-hop. Execs exist to make money, if they don't make money, they're done. They get into a situation where they can sign one of two un-known cats. The first one is kicken something that sounds very hard, very much Chronicesque (I just wanted to use that word). The second one is kicking some hippy-dippy schwag that sounds like it's a b-side from the 60's. They don't care if it's provocative, interesting, or even a truer representation of hip-hop. A lot of money on the line, they're taking the (hopefully) sure thing.

As for the original topic, strong, political hip-hop being ignored by black population. I think that's a bit more complex. First, I'd have to address it from the American perspective, I have no idea what's going on in the more interesting parts of the world. One thing to keep in mind, hip-hop is no longer a black-only music. It is now very cross race and cross culture. Given that, at any particular concert, you expect to see a makeup that reflects the makeup of the US. The US is made up of 97.6% single race individuals, so we'll simplify the stats. The white population is 75.1% of the country and the black population is 12.3%.. So, if we take the example of Boots Riley, who claims his audience is 95% white, we're not dealing with that big of a gap in what we'd expect. Additionally, 24.9% of the black population lives in poverty, where as only 9.1% of the white population live in poverty. Concerts take money, so you expect to see more white people there as well. The ideal hip-hop sales/concert/radio market should split in the same manor that the country (and the world) as a whole splits.

This dumbing down is not isolated to hip-hop either. I would argue that it was very strange that intelligent hip-hop was every successful at all. There's ample evidence of dumbing down of everything. For example, compare the viewership of NOVA (or any show on PBS) with the viewership of American Idol for example. NOVA is design to increase the knowledge and understanding of it's viewers, American Idol is design to provide some music and to mock individuals. Which correlates to KRS-ONE and which to 50 Cent? Look at the news for another example. How often do you, or anyone, watch the news and gain a truly informed position on any given issue? Compare that with how many times you catch a seven-word sound bite on an issue. Which gets more viewers, the 30 minute local news coverage of something or C-SPAN which shows the details of things as they happen? Despite some minor changes in the past 10 years, local news still claims the major viewership.

I would also argue that there has been significant change since the 80's and early 90's that has also affected these sales, at least some what. The number of important black figures and history that is taught in your average classroom has changed significantly in the past 10-20 years. In the 80's you had a situation where school would give you the impression that America was built solely on the backs of white people, they're the only ones who did important things and are important. So, some kid listening to hip-hop of the time would get a very different view of the world through hip-hop. Where as today, black culture is finally getting some attention in school systems. (though many other cultures are still being ignored) So, the result is, music is no longer as significant educator that it was before.

I believe that a significant issue is how Americans choose to spend their time, and with at least some justification, is work load. If I go either to school for 6 1/2 hours (or what ever it is these days) or I go to work for 8 hours, by the time I get home, I'm tired. I want to enjoy myself and unwind. If I have two choices, one involves me grabbing a cold beer and watching the Colts and the other one involves me engaging my mind in yet another activity, then, well, I'm tired, I worked hard, and I deserve to relax.

That's my two cents, but I could be entirely wrong. :wink:

[bigted]

:yeahthat: Schnazz droppin' some knowledge there! Hey y'all I think the lyrics to "I Wish I Made That" is relevant to this post:

"Yo, ain’t no better man for this hype track

Just the veteran taking the mic back

David Letterman even said he like that track man

Even though he ain’t a rap fan

Black radio, they won’t play though

Ever since “Summertime” they ain’t liked none of mine

Even though the fans went out & bought enough

I guess they think Will ain’t hard enough

Maybe I should just have a shoot out

Run up in the bank, bustin’, grabbin’ all the loot out

Whoop somebody ass, taking my boot out

Right on TV so ya’ll can see me

Just ignorant, attacking, actin’ rough

I mean, then will I be black enough

Oh wait maybe I’ll jack a truck

Full of cigarettes, guns & drugs & stuff

CHORUS – (2xs)

Get that

I wish I would of made that

Lean back

I wish I would of made that

I wish I woulda told the girls to ‘drop it like it hot’

Summer, Summer, Summertime

Seem like all I got

I always envied how ya’ll rock wit Dre & the Chronic

The way that Tupac, Biggie, 50 and Jigga got it

A lot like L.L., Chuck D, Slick & Dougie

I think ya’ll love me, but ya’ll place other rappers above me

& I don’t know if you feel my flow

& be at my show & you’ll see where I should go

On the charts of rhyme arts & thoughts in rap form

Damnit, I expanded the platform

Damnit, this Cat’s on a rap song

Yeah, it ain’t no braids or plats on

Ain’t on stage wit no gats on

You know I’m afraid, getting’ my act on

It might have stunted my growth

But I wanted them both

& I hope that it would be less tougher

You do two things & then they both gonna suffer

I chose to act & it broke my heart not to rap

Prodigal son, clever, better than ever, back"

Edited June 28, 2005 by bigted

[TopDawg14]

Here's my take on the subject:

I think the article is on point in a lot of aspects.

I think there are a lot of young white cats who genuinely love hip-hop. I think they actually listen to the lyrics and understand where the rapper is coming from. I also think there are a lot of posers. These kids are surburbanites who either listen to rap because that's what's hot or they're doing it to rebel against the "preppy" lifestyle.

As far as black kids not buying the music, I think it's simple - we're not respecting the art form of hip-hop. I think a lot of the blame does go on us because we are not teaching young kids the history of the art form and what we could really do with the art form. We've pimped the art form as a means to make money and when you do that then you're willing to say and do anything to sell records. There is somehow this new measure of "blackness" going on in my communities. In this day, you're not black if you're not thugged out. Hence cats like Will, De La, Talib Kweli, The Roots, dead prez, Mos Def and Common don't get a lot of shine. And let's not even begin to talk about being Christian and an emcee. You gets no love in the black community. I think it's a disgrace that 50 can sell over 4 million CDs but a emcee like The Ambassador(Christian emcee) can only move 35,000 copies.

The industry has a lot to do with this too. It's all about lowering to the lowest-common denominator. It's not just hip-hop, it's music and television in general. The way to keep people uneducated and uninformed is to distract their minds. Sensationsalism works in America and all over the world for that matter. Ask your average "rap" fan about the 50/Game "beef" and they can tell you all about it. Ask them about the genocide going on in Dafur and they'll have no clue.

I don't want to get preachy because I know people have different religions on this board but I think the real reason is that society is pushing morals out. That really explains why 50 is so popular. The industry continues to dumb down the public to the point where anything and everything is acceptable. There is no way a song like "Candy Shop" makes it radio 20 years ago. Now it's all sex, drugs, clubs and rims all the time.

I have more to say but I'm running short on time.

[Turntable]

I`m sorry but i thini it`s just a shame that people talk abut the color of the skin!

That has nothing to dow with it!

Sometimes i hear stuff about being white and being not real because of that and stuf like that hurts..

I`m not saying that one of you said stuff like that!I never saw a coment like that heer but it hapens to much no mather where..

:thatsux:

[JumpinJack AJ]

I'm with u on that. People always wanna label and categorize stuff.

[Da Brakes]

I'm with u on that.  People always wanna label and categorize stuff.

←

I hear that!

[264]

i would have to disagree with some of you most groups aren't dime a dozen like g-unit obviously they are talented enough to get a record deal and people go for whats sounds good so i can't totally knock your opinion because thats what you believe even though that dosen't always make it true

[Turntable]

i would have to disagree with some of you most groups aren't dime a dozen like g-unit  obviously they are talented enough to get a record deal and people go for whats sounds good so i can't totally knock your opinion because thats what you believe even though that dosen't always make it true

←

Yeah it`s sounds good for them..

But i think that`s because most of them don`t no much Artists!

I have Friends who listened to G-Unit an them until i showed them more stuff..

Know what i mean?

[264]

i understand you are saying that there is more to the world (and i agree than gunit ) which is true they ain't the only game in town