The current state of Hip-Hop

[DevilsJim89]

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Is Kanye West Overrated? Can The Same Be Said For Hip-Hop?
Posted on Saturday, April 03 @ 12:14:31 PST by MusicMan
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Anonymous writes "Chuck D (the old school rapper) has been quoted saying that "Kanye West is overrated and has been called ground-breaking just for speeding up old records." I agree with him.

Nowadays in Hip-Hop we are so soon to bombard people with accolades for even having sub-standard talent. Yet real MC's are just forgotten. Be honest, you rushed out to buy "The College Dropout" or "Get Rich or Die Trying" but you don't know about real Hip-Hop.

You're not familiar with the music of Avant or Common but you know all the words to "In da club." Is that what Hip-Hop is today? A podium for guys who can barely hold a flow to talk about how hard they had it, what they have now, cars, bling and chicks etc. Is anything original?

Hip-Hop is just a popular cult-following which used to stand for something. Take a chain of egotistical, chauvistic, Tupac/Biggie wannabe lyrics and a beat from the 90's and there you have it. A #1 on the Billboard charts.

Even the crème-de-la-crème of Hip-Hop are leaving us to go into movies, fashion or retirement; LL Cool J, Ice Cube, Jay-Z etc Who's gonna save the game? Are we just subject to a decade of poor music? How many more 50 Cent's will blow up for doing nothing?

We need to save Hip-Hop because as fans, buyers and listeners we're becoming too easily impressed. Hip-Hop's only as overrated as we make it. So let's not."

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Rap's Deterioration From Expression To Ego
Posted on Friday, April 02 @ 17:45:02 PST by MusicMan
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Jenna writes "I know that by now most of us are sick of the topic of battles, but after the 'How Far Is This Gonna Go' article I just wanted to say something about "rap wars" in general. People all have their opinions on Ja Rule and 50 Cent obviously, as well as on all the other battling rappers of the past and present. But I just don't understand the support given to these ridiculous things and the public reaction to it, like everyone is just sitting there waiting for the next problem to start up, so that they will have something to talk about. Obviously when you are a fan of any type of music, and any musician in general you get attached, and want to defend them or at least don't want to see anything happen to them. But I for one think that these battles are completely destroying the rap industry.

Rap came about around the 70s, and it started out as good beats until the MCs began to talk over the music they made; giving shout-outs, endorsing themselves etc. Now most of these people don't even care about the music itself, they just use whatever works best behind their ryhmes...so it's become about the words...that would be fine, except for the fact that now even the words have become meaningless. Rap used to be able to pride itself on being the truest form of expression; compared to the mundane and repetative songs of pop or rock which have no message, no real passion, just songs about break-ups, love, love again etc.

Rap used to talk to people; even as recently as N.W.A who really brought the streets into suburbia and showed people what actually happened in their own country, or KRS-One who wanted to be a positive influence, or Tupac who (before all the beef) made memorable impressions with songs like "Brenda's Got a Baby"....now it has become completely predictable. Someone says; "I'm the best in the world, I get the most hoes, I make the best ryhmes etc." then someone else challenges this and those two spend the next few years arguing like little kids...I am actually getting sick of hearing about who is better, why someone hates someone else, it's not about expression anymore, just ego.

And if the destruction of this artform weren't bad enough, battles also occsionally get people killed (not by the rappers themselves) and it is their own fault because they know perfectly well that they have tons of fans who idolize them and hang on their every word, and that if they just feed them hatred, it can easily manifest itself into a deadly situation...At least that is my opinion on the whole thing, I just wish someone new (or maybe a return from someone older) would come into the game and give us something real again."
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I can't describe how much I agree with them. All points are covered. We need the old-skoolers to come back. Save the industry. Edited June 7, 2004 by DevilsJim89

[Hero1]

i think the music buying public has to change not the artists..their are some good artists out there..but the people who are buying music are younger and younger and they just dont know quality...

[JumpinJack AJ]

I only read the 1st half of that...but i totally agree. It's hard 2 have a conversation with younger fans of Hip-Hop cuz they don't know what it is...they simply don't know any better. They are totally ignorant about what real Hip-Hop is about and they don't know what good music should sound like cuz they are rarely exposed 2 it. 2 me, it just looks like a hopeless cause unless the real artists step up and make things happen themselves. Young MC, Coolio, etc are still releasing music, but they aren't signing with labels that will promote them correctly and they are settling for average production which ultimatly don't get them anywhere.

Fresh Prince, L.L. Cool J, and Queen Latifah stay busy with so many other projects like movies, their own businesses, other artists, etc, which isn't a bad thing but it keeps them from focusing totally on the music. I personally don't blame them tho' cuz the money simply isn't in just rapping. U can only stay in one place for so long so i think it's a natural progression 2 do other things. But the music suffers when good artists like that wait 4 or 5 years between albums.

The people who do get played on the radio simply don't care about their music, their fans or about the culture that some people associate them with. They preach poison, they don't bother 2 even try and be creative, they simply want fame and money. They'll find out a few years tho' when their fame dies, they have STDs from nasty groupies, and they realized they sold out all their real friends 4 business that played them why they played all the people in their lives.

[WildWildWillennium]

I think artists and fans are setting their standards 2 low. We as fans should appreciate the good in Hip-Hop and encourage it, rather than take what's new and shove it down our throats just cuz that's what's there at the moment. Artists should do the same. Quit givin' out "new ****" and start takin' time 2 make quality music. People actually consider G-Unit 2 be one of the greatest out now. If we keep letting this nonsense get forced onto us and not take time 2 search 4 the good, this is what's gonna happen. There's no way 4 any of the youth today 2 find quality music, cuz what they're introduced 2 ARE the 50 Cents, the Nellys, etc. Now I'm not saying a big sudden change is gonna happen anytime soon, but at least that should be enuf of a reason 2 make the effort 2 search 4 the good in the game...rather than take in whatever's thrown 2 us.

[Guest lambertj3]

OBVIOUSLY the person who started this thread is a HATER opinions are like assholes evryones got them. and just because i like 50 cent dosen't mean i don't know anything about what you and i do mean YOU consider real hip hop because i don't really think you know what real hip hop is.

[JumpinJack AJ]

No offense, but i'd really like 2 know where u come from and how old u are. Your exposure 2 Rap, your opinions, and your ways of conveying your ideas just seem like u are some young kid from from some place that only gets 2 hear top 10 Rap...which sucks 90% of the time. I'm not trying 2 be ignorant, i just think it may clear up why i can't agree with one thing u say.

[Silver Tiger]

"Nowadays in Hip-Hop we are so soon to bombard people with accolades for even having sub-standard talent."

That's it right there. We've become so used to crap that people are now thinking the "okay" stuff is great.

I liked it better when you had to be good to do this. Not when you knew producers.

God Blessa!

[DevilsJim89]

[quote=JumpinJack AJ,Jun 7 2004, 07:13 AM]No offense, but i'd really like 2 know where u come from and how old u are. Your exposure 2 Rap, your opinions, and your ways of conveying your ideas just seem like u are some young kid from from some place that only gets 2 hear top 10 Rap...which sucks 90% of the time. I'm not trying 2 be ignorant, i just think it may clear up why i can't agree with one thing u say.[/quote]
Same here. You OBVIOUSLY do not know what real hip-hop & rap is and you don't know what it was built on.

It wasn't built on cursing, talking about hoes, violence, rape and all that negative stuff. And that is 95% of today's hip-hop. You and I know it. If you wanna listen to it, then go ahead. We aren't telling you what you should and shouldn't listen to but we're all just talking about how much of the industry is crap right now. whatever man.

[WildWildWillennium]

[quote=djsilvertiger,Jun 7 2004, 08:57 AM]We've become so used to crap that people are now thinking the "okay" stuff is great.[/quote]
Exactly man. If the wack artists out there aren't gonna improve their music, we should make better choices as 2 what we listen 2.

And lambert, I haven't agreed with many of your posts either...U are the one that doesn't know about real Hip-Hop, so u should probably think twice before posting something u don't know anything about. Here's a tip. Instead of being ignorant and pretending like u know everything in the world when u don't, try 2 keep an open mind and listen 2 people that actually do know what they're talking about. I'm not saying I know everything, and neither do I agree with everybody all the time...but at least I keep an open mind. Just try it man...it'll save u from further embarassment.

[bigted]

I have some points to make about the current state of the hip-hop game.
#1-Hip-hoppers don't focus that much on performance today like Public Enemy, LL Cool J, KRS-ONE, Beastie Boys, JJFP, and other ol' school m.c.'s did in the late '80s and early '90s.
#2-Ever since TRL was introduced, hip-hop has gone down, we can't be associated wit Britney, NSync, and Jessica Simpson. :cussing:
#3-Only the m.c's that talk about guns, sex, cars, and other material **** get promotion, while real cats like Coolio and KRS-ONE make albums and nobody cares! :tear:
#4-Why the hell does every rapper gotta say the "N" word all the time? Hip-hop is supposed to be for all races not just for black people!! Hey I'm black but I think it's time to stop talkin' so ignorant we have to learn to avoid racism 'cause it's stupid!
#5-Rappers are afraid to step up their game a notch. Hey I like 50 Cent and I respect his hustle in the game but he has to bring something more positive in order to expand his talent. Like KRS-ONE says:"You are not just doing hip-hop, you are hip-hop".
This is a very depressing subject to talk about and I don't know when it's gonna change!! :dunno: Edited June 8, 2004 by bigted

[Hero1]

i think we did go through a similar time say from 95-98 where it was nothing but negative gangsta rap..after that a few ol skool artists decided to come back out..hopefully this is a current trend and switches up..fast!

[JumpinJack AJ]

I think Hip-Hop/Rap has hit rock bottom....we are either gonna stay in this awful place or things are gonna get better...cuz i don't think it can get any worse.

And i also agree with that statement about how neglected Hip-Hop fans have been that we think the okay stuff is great....like my opinion on the Mase track...ha ha.

[TopDawg14]

The state of Hip-Hop, in my opinion, goes as follows:

1. It's all about money and business. The minute that hip-hop became mainstream is when hip-hop began going down the tubes. On the one hand, it's great that hip-hop got this exposure but hip-hop got swallowed up by greed, money and success(remember Will's line in Born To Reign: "States have been altered by liquor, by weed/while hate gets exalted as art falls to greed."). The art form that was the basis for hip-hop has been replaced by money, cars and other forms of materialism.

2. Where are the great MCs? In the 80's you had cats like KRS-One, LL, Kool Moe Dee, Latifah, Fresh Prince, Chuck D, Rakim, Big Daddy Kane, etc, etc. All of them are great MCs and all with a different style. Who would be considered great today? Not many in my book. Jay-Z has one of the best flows I have ever heard in my life but 9 times out of 10 he wastes his flow on garbage lyrics. Nas? Which Nas is it? The Nas that does "I Can" and Illmatic or the Nas that does "Oochie Wally"? Tupac? Before he joined Death Row he was on his way to hall of fame status but his time at Death Row killed that status. Biggie? I like Biggie(like Jay-Z he had a crazy flow) but most of lyrics weren't meaningful. The rest of today's rappers(50 Cent, Ja Rule and everybody else)are basically straight garbage. Common, Black Though of the Roots, Mos Def, and Talib Kweli are great MCs but they are few are far between.

3. At some point we as fans of true hip-hop are going to have to take back the music before it's completely destroyed. If we want change then we have to let these artists and labels know that the music that's out now IS NOT HIP-HOP! The only way for the music industry to understand is for us to stop buying and listening to all of this garbage. We have to show these wack artists(do you hear me 50 Cent?) and labels that we control the music and not them. Stop settling for hot garbage on wax and start demanding a higher quality of music.

[DevilsJim89]

[quote=TopDawg14,Jun 8 2004, 12:50 AM]The state of Hip-Hop, in my opinion, goes as follows:

1. It's all about money and business. The minute that hip-hop became mainstream is when hip-hop began going down the tubes. On the one hand, it's great that hip-hop got this exposure but hip-hop got swallowed up by greed, money and success(remember Will's line in Born To Reign: "States have been altered by liquor, by weed/while hate gets exalted as art falls to greed."). The art form that was the basis for hip-hop has been replaced by money, cars and other forms of materialism.

2. Where are the great MCs? In the 80's you had cats like KRS-One, LL, Kool Moe Dee, Latifah, Fresh Prince, Chuck D, Rakim, Big Daddy Kane, etc, etc. All of them are great MCs and all with a different style. Who would be considered great today? Not many in my book. Jay-Z has one of the best flows I have ever heard in my life but 9 times out of 10 he wastes his flow on garbage lyrics. Nas? Which Nas is it? The Nas that does "I Can" and Illmatic or the Nas that does "Oochie Wally"? Tupac? Before he joined Death Row he was on his way to hall of fame status but his time at Death Row killed that status. Biggie? I like Biggie(like Jay-Z he had a crazy flow) but most of lyrics weren't meaningful. The rest of today's rappers(50 Cent, Ja Rule and everybody else)are basically straight garbage. Common, Black Though of the Roots, Mos Def, and Talib Kweli are great MCs but they are few are far between.

3. At some point we as fans of true hip-hop are going to have to take back the music before it's completely destroyed. If we want change then we have to let these artists and labels know that the music that's out now IS NOT HIP-HOP! The only way for the music industry to understand is for us to stop buying and listening to all of this garbage. We have to show these wack artists(do you hear me 50 Cent?) and labels that we control the music and not them. Stop settling for hot garbage on wax and start demanding a higher quality of music.[/quote]
Awesome! I FULLY AGREE!

[bigted]

True, I thought that "Oochie Wallie" was garbage, but other than that though Nas is the most versatile rapper currently in the game that I truely respect, it takes a lot of balls to make a song like "I Wanna Talk To You" and "Life's a B", my only problem with him is that he says the "N" word way too much! Nas's inspiration Chuck D is one of the rappers that ain't afraid to bring up anything, he speaks alot of politics in his raps, which makes him controversial, but is postive because he's not afraid to speak his mind, and even if you don't agree with him you can feel his point of view, even though I like Kanye West, Chuck's right, 'cause back when PE was on the scene, nobody would pay attention to Kanye! Chuck D should seriously run for president along with KRS-ONE 'cause they are the smartest cats in our generation!