Are we ruining Hiphop?

[Frenetic]

So.. I've been away from the forum for quite a while now. Been busy with alot things in my life that I needed to clear up before going on.

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I read an interview with a musicreporter where the reporter said that the music isn't getting worse, but what is getting worse is in fact the listeners.

And I totally agree with this dude.

I can basically sum it up in a short example:

When I didn't know how to download songs and so, I used too buy my albums. I used to save up money to afford buying an album. And U bought alot of albums, not just albums from artists i loved, but also from rappers I was curious about.

And when u spend money in albums and buying music and so, u listen to it in a completly other way. When i bought my albums, I used to sit in my room for like 2 straight days and just listen to it. Cuz that was money there, I had paid for it and I was determined to listen to it. So I sat down in my room and listened to music until i either liked it or got sick of it.

Most of the times i liked it cuz when u sit down and analyse or really listen to the lyrics of a song, u'll find things u hadn't heard before and u start to dig it. And that's still how I listen to music and I get alot of crap for it. Cause I love Jay-Z, Nas, Kanye, Will, Lupe and I do like The Games new album too. Because I have really sat down and analysed the songs.

BUT, nowadays u got like the internet. U download a album, play it once and if it doesn't appear to you as if it's Jesus walking out of your speakers, then u don't like it and throw it away. People just don't listen to music anymore. That's why almost every damn album nowadays is considered a letdown or a flop, cuz we as listeners don't take our time to really listen to the music.

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U guys prolly can think of your own examples in artists u like that u don't think get the right acknowledgement. Damn, FP is certainly one of those the last years.

And this ain't a fanboy thread or a artist thread but I do feel like Jays last album is really damn good. I can sit and write qoutable from it all day long if I wanted to, because I have listened to it. The same with like Game or Kanye. And people get surprised by that. They're like: "damn! did Game/Kanye really say that?".

So... Do u agree? Are we ruining music by downloading and just throwing music away without giving the artists a fair chance?

[bigted]

I agree with that, some people don't buy albums unless they're classics and they really miss out on great music, I understand how people do that "this album ain't as good as his.... album so i ain't gonna listen", the expectation level really is something that sorta really gets people to miss out on great music, I see that happening with a lot of great rappers like DMX, LL, Outkast, Ice Cube, etc. didn't put out their best albums this year but they put out some quality music again, they all deserve to sell more than what they did, people been doing that to Nas too since his albums don't sound like "Illmatic", he put out great music since then but not on that level so people decide to miss out on him, now Game did a much better album this time than his first, Kanye sorta improved on his last album too but maybe their big egos might hurt their popularity gradually, music fans find one exuse or another not to buy an album so I understand why Will might not feel like rapping anymore

Edited November 22, 2006 by bigted

[ash trey]

I guess I'll have to blame myself...because I don't buy music unless it's an artist I love...or a classic album I downloaded and liked.

By the way I really didn't feel Game's album as much as most people did...ok that nas track was the bomb but apart from that there wasn't one classic...so am I really missing out on something?

Edited November 22, 2006 by ash trey

[Turntable]

I agree. Allot of people are bitching about the state of Hip Hop, but almost nobody of them bought Ghostface's, Method Man's etc Album's.

[Pakalicous]

I agree. Allot of people are bitching about the state of Hip Hop, but almost nobody of them bought Ghostface's, Method Man's etc Album's.

I bought Ghostface.. Method's album was'nt that great.. average album in my opinion.. Bu Fishscale is a classic one.. Waiting for Ghostface's new album.. Think it's called Fishscale II..

[Turntable]

I wonder how long Jigga's gonna shuffle that,lol

[dparrott]

Albums/artists are not as good as they were back in the days, straight up. In the 80's, most of the popular rappers were unique: you can easily tell the difference between a Public Enemy song and a De La Soul song, an LL song or a Kool Moe Dee song, etc. Now, with a few exceptions, it's not like that. Even when the artist sounds unique, the music/production is not. The classic rappers are using new producers to keep up with the times. I listen to the hip-hop stations here, I usually can't tell artists apart anymore, and it irritates me to hear different rappers make similar sounding music. There's a reason why rap music in the 80's and 90's is considered "classic": it was *quality*. Most rappers were more talented then, and there was a lot less negativity in the music. It was music that was full of thought and creative and fun.

As I've gotten older, I keep looking for music that is really unique, like the DangerDoom CD. MF Doom has a unique flow and lyrics, and the music is definitely not something you'd hear on the radio today.

So it's not just the fact that we are not "listening" to the music, but the music itself is not worth listening to.

[bigted]

Well if people actually supported real rappers like I said all along hip-hop would be where it needs to be, you have to accept that not everything great rappers do will be a classic or groundbreaking but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't support them 'cause if you don't support them then the record labels will drop them and sign more watered down rappers instead, I rather hear LL's new songs getting played on the radio rather then another "laffy taffy" or another bow wow song, that's what's gonna kill hip-hop really, support real hip-hop, i'd rather see an average method man sell 5 million rather than garbage 50 cent album sell 5 million anyday, "lost and found" could've easily sold 3 million like "he's the dj, i'm the rapper", all those older fans though probably don't consider "lost and found" to be on the same level as "he's the dj, i'm the rapper" so they didn't buy it while 5 million white kids run out to buy a garbage eminem album at that time with no hesititation, older fans are too picky while kids will buy any garbage that gets promoted that's why rap's so watered down right now the way I see it, i'm not really talking about you here, i'm talking about fans in general, basically everyone here is open minded, you don't have to buy every album but you shouldn't just wait for a classic album to come out to buy it, that's a wrong mentality to have, if you really only buy music 'cause it's classic then hip-hop is dead, Chuck D recently said in a terrordome that 1996 was the last year of classic hip-hop, I guess when 2Pac died classic hip-hop died too, the golden era is over but that don't mean that hip-hop died

Edited November 22, 2006 by bigted

[Frenetic]

Bigted//

Yea, we might think that Ye and Game are a bunch of jerks.. but really do you really care as long as they put out quality music? I against that state of mind where you shouldn't like someones music just cause they dumbasses outside of the music. And that isn't just about Game or Ye, but also people like Madonna, Michael Jackson etc.

Dparrot//

So you mean that Game, Kanye, Jay, Nas, Eminem and T.I all sound the same? aaaw noo...

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A couple of qoutables from the last years:

"Black church services, murderers, Arabs serving burger its

Cats with gold permanents move they bags as herbalist

The dirt isn't just fertile its people working & earning this

The curb-getters go where the cash flow & the current is"

Common - The Corners

"Used to think that I was hard, so I stole my brothers glock

And that's the day my life changed 'cause that night he got shot

Killed by another Crip over his Rolex watch"

The Game - Ol' English

"The worst drug known to man

It's stronger than, heroin

When you could look in the mirror like, "There I am"

And still not see, what you've become"

Jay-Z - Lost One

"And now we ooze it, through they nooks and crannies

So our mommas ain't got to be they, cooks and nannies

And we gon' repo everything they ever took from grammy

Now the former slaves trade hooks, for Grammy's

This dark diction, has become America's addiction

Those who ain't even black use it

We gon' keep baggin up this here, crack music"

Kanye West - Crack Music.

I could basically go on forever with qoutables from great songs from the latest years. And i bet u that like 80% of todays hiphopaudience haven't even paid attention to at least 70% of the great lines and qoutables. It about listening man. We don't do that anymore!

[dparrott]

Of course not.

Even when the artist sounds unique, the music/production is not.

Nas is one of the few exceptions, he usually comes hard with beats and vocals. But from what I have heard, and I could be wrong in some cases, the music of those artists are pretty similar. For example, Dre's beats do not sound like beats KRS-One would use, where as Nas uses a good variety of beats, including old school beats.

And what you are *not* listening to is how similar those lyrics are. And those are 4 examples of the countless other rappers who write the same kind of lyrics. That just illustrates my point.

Edited November 22, 2006 by dparrott

[Frenetic]

Games albums is raw westcoast gangstarap.

Jay is very introspective.

Nas is both introspective and very concerned or in touch with what happens with other artists.

Kanye is the most "food for thought" of those examples.

T.I is a slow party dude.

Eminem is very personal.

Hell no they ain't the same. And they don't write about the same thing.

The production is something I've also thought about the last year, but you can''t compare the beats on Hovas albums with those on T.I:s or Kanyes or Games. None of them sound the same.

[dparrott]

OK, I'll take your word for it.

[Lerkot]

Nope, they are not all the same. Different styles, some of them wack and some of them... even more wack. At best decent.

However, I doubt WE are ruining hiphop.. but some are.. and its probably the listeners and the media, yes.

[bigted]

I agree that there is a variety of styles still out there, there's a major difference between DMX and Outkast albums, DMX got that gritty east coast sound while Outkast got that laid back southern sound, but if you're waiting on another golden era then I guess hip-hop must be dead then, btw that's cool that you post quotables, Turntable had a post like that called "rhyme of the day", we should bring that back, btw here's some rhymes that I've been feeling this year, it's really hard to think that hip-hop's dead when you hear mcs make rhymes like this, people need to quit bitching and just listen for real:

DMX "Life Be My Song":

"to live is to suffer

and i'm living it up

face everyday chin up

I ain't giving it up

cause if I aint giving a ****

the who will?!

so I hope for the best

knowing that its all uphill

sometimes I wonder what's lifes about

sometimes I wonder why I take the wrong route

then turn around and go out

and no doubt, the fate in mine is blind

so whatever, **** it, I'ma roll out

we all go through the motions

we get different notions

we each have our own ocean

that we can either drown or float

like the vessels that we are

vessels that would carry many far"

Ice Cube "The N***a Trap"

"You only got two places

State of California, got two faces

Mother****in devils, get straight racist

When they get you in them lonely dark places

Concrete slave ships, never move

Where niggaz like us get used like a mule

Don't let 'em catch you, arrest you

Strip and undress you, throw you in a cesspool

You wanna know the crime of the century

A ghetto elementary, a mental penitentiary

Black man, you never been friend of me

Boy you kin to me, why we enemies?"

Method Man "Say"

"Ask Miss Hill, half these critics ain't got half this skill

Often so hungry that they have to steal

If I didn't have my deal, and didn't have this mass appeal

Then I'm back up in that trap, swingin' crack it's real

And that ain't worth the time, so search and find a new nerve

And here's three words: stop working mine

It take a lot more to hurt my pride

Jerk my vibe more than media lies, cry when dirt dog die nigga

The last album wasn't feeling my style

This time my foot up in they ass but they feelin' me now

Cause Tical, he put his heart in every track he do

But somehow yall find someway to give a whack review

It ain't all good, they writin' that I'm Hollywood

Tryin' to tell you my **** ain't ghetto and they hardly hood

Come on man, until you dudes can write some rhymes

Keep that in mind when you find yourself reciting mines"

[dparrott]

Cube's LNCL album was really good, a lot of strong statements made in his lyrics. That's the kinda stuff the veterans need to come with. Forget what's popular and be true to yourself.